What happened to all the files?!?

I guess we'll see more shareware in the future where the software has restrictions such as a 30 day timeout, limited number of starts, timeout popups and such to let people test software before buying.

zzd10h: Perhaps you should consider making these shareware? Does AmiStore support such a thing? As shareware there's no need to maintain two separate versions of each program.

I suppose, If someone's willing to do it, a standard method for issueing shareware keys could be made. Like a few functions in a simple shared library that takes care of encryption and whatnot. When you download shareware from AmiStore you get a temporary shareway key generated by the AmiStore server on the day of download. If you decide to buy the package you get a new key that unlocks whatever limitations that the software previously had.

@zzd10h

Quote:

Technically it would still be possible, however it would be open to abuse (you only need to trick AmiUpdate into thinking you already have it installed, if you look through the logs you could find the full download URL too).

If AmiUpdate had some AmiStore integration where it took your AmiStore username and password (same as the OS4 update server) then that would solve this as it would only serve things you have access to. I'm sure that could be done relatively easily.

I got bored and wrote this specification for a simple shareware license key system in case someone gets inspired and implements it:


PayMe, A simple shareware license key management system.

The system consists of three parts.
- A Small program for creating a program key string. The program takes input data such as the author full name, birth date, current date etc and generates the key via some destructive encryption.
- A Small program for creating license files encrypted with the program key generated above. The license files should include program name, issue date, purchase date and other customer data.
A non licenced key file is created by leaving the customer data and purchase date empty.
- An statically linked library with simple functions for verifying that the program is bought and for retrieving customer data.

The programs are used by the author. The library is linked with the program when compiling.

The license files are stored in env-arc: using the program name as prefix and license as suffix:
cpudocky.license

The statically linked library would have the following functions:

/* Verity that there is a valid keyfile regardless of if the program is bought or not (See non licenced key above).
Returns FALSE if the program keyfile is not found or if it can't be decrypted.
programKey is a constant string inside the executable containing the program key generated by the author. */
bool isVerified(STRPTR appName, STRPTR programKey)

/* Verify that the program is unlocked, IE bought.
Returns FALSE if the program keyfile is not found or if it can't be decrypted.
programKey is a constant string inside the executable containing the program key generated by the author. */
bool isUnlocked(STRPTR appName, STRPTR programKey)

/* Get the issue date for a specific program.
Returns NULL if the program keyfile is not found or if it can't be decrypted.
programKey is a constant string inside the executable containing the program key generated by the author. */
Date getIssueDate(STRPTR appName, STRPTR programKey)

/* Get customer full name
Returns NULL if the program keyfile is not found.
programKey is a constant string inside the executable containing the program key generated by the author. */
STRPTR getCustomerFullName(STRPTR appName, STRPTR programKey)

... more customer data functions ...

Some design rationale:

The system would not be very strong. You could just extract the program key out of the executable to generate your own license file or copy the licence file from someone else. But it should provide enough protection to motivate the more honest oriented end users. End users motivated to circumvent license schemes will do so regardless of how much effort is put into stopping it.

Your program can be designed to use this system in a number of different ways. For example, if you want to have a 30 day limit you would have to generate the non licensed key at the time of download. Such as when the end user downloads the file from AmiStore. If you simply want to impose limitations, annoying popups or similar you could just skip the non licensed key and not use the isVerified() method in the library.

But why statically link the library?!? because it would be embarrassingly easy for someone to replace an amiga .library with one that always gives the right answers suddenly opening up any shareware limitations.

@Chris
Quote:

I think AmiStore may offer an update facility, though having not tested it I'm not sure.

AS regards AmiUpdate if the AmiStore download url is fixed and the access is contraoled by AmiSpehere password login , the there is no reason why amiupdate might not be used to deliver updates, as they will only be accessible by users that bought it, other wise if the url varies per user or changes with every update then using amiupdate along with appstore will be less easy.

I'd think it would be a good idea to intergrate the two, there no need for competition as they server seperate purposes.

Afer all AmiUpdate was designed to allow password protected acces to beta system components, and now public updates.

@Uninstall

Those asking for Uninstallers should bear in mind that uninstalling components is always more complex to do autmatically, particularly in the area of shared libraries ( whichever style) as these may be required by other applicatioins. Sensible aplication design would keep private libraries in the application folder, and only install third party libs to the system in general. Thus uninstall simply become the act of deleting the program directory.

Can I buy only Sysmon? It's the only one I use

So it looks like lots of software that used to be freeware will now be only for rich people, thanks to the greed of certain developers.

This AmiStore is clearly damaging the Amiga community already, I will never buy anything from it and urge others not to do so either.

@Minuous

Rich people for a few euro una tantum ? :v

@Minuous

"the greed of certain developers" "for rich people".

Ah ah ah, asking just few euros for a pack of softwares that I developed since 2 years.

That I have (and will) continuously maintained, supported replying to each improvements requests each particular bugs.

Did you still used one of the programs listed in the first post of this thread ?

-If no, it should not hurt you, no problem for you, right ?
-If yes, you have noticed that I updated them continuously since 2 years...

But I understand that for you it's more a principle problem.
No money, even ridiculous amount, should be asked for the very very lot of time spent in front of a computer... (except your own time to you Minuous, certainly)

@Orgin
yes a library could be used but I know nothing about Library development.
But sure, if a library like that existed, I could add a "requester reminder".


@Broadblues
it's why I thought that AmiUpdate will be no more useable, because the link will be static.

@Orgin

Maybe this "library" or dependency can be provided by AmiStore itself?

It's not out yet, so at least i don't know what features it will have for developers and those that like to provide their stuff through it.

Maybe a betatester can confiirm?

If there's already a system of keeping track of bought (or test) software (and i'm pretty sure there will be at least an internal list for every user) then it should be dead easy to do so for Guillaume, right?

@zzd10h

Please don't get me wrong about the "essential" updates part...i was merely saying that i will keep using your software, but i may not immediately get it from AmiStore if there hasn't been any changes...it's as you said, people who have already installed it knows how good it is and will surely keep on using it...me included.

Well, I've been using (and testing many of zzd10h tools).

I don't know if the price has already been mentionned so I will only say that the the price for the full pack will be below the 10€.

aTunes *alone* should already cost more than this (if you've never used it or downloaded it when it was available, you missed THE BEST music database available).

SysMon would cost about 5€ for all the work put in this monitoring tool.

FastView is what should have been done for AmigaOS 4.x for a long time now. Easily displaying you pictures (scaled or nor), convert or modify them and open them from a simple double clik on the WB. Far more proweful than our old Multiview.

5€ again for Fastview would be the minimum.

Regarding dockies, they are by far the most complete ones to monitor all your system (network, cpu usage, ram usage, video memory usage).

For all the work on these useful tools : 5€ too.

If you've never used FastCompress, you shoulad have tried it. Even easier than Cranu. Select a drawer, and select FastLha or FastZip (or Lzx or 7z) to create in one clik an archive of your drawer.

2€ for the work put in Fastcompress would be the minimum.

I do not use Attachmail, FastHide nor FlipPaper. I have no use of them. So I won't give any price for them.

I'm also using WebReplay to watch video from different sites (mainly from JeuxVideo.com). Really useful.

So, just for those I'm using, I should pay about 20€ for the softwares.

Here we are too used to have everything for free (look : some are even complaining for the 30€ bucks to pay for AmigaOS 4.1 Final Edition).

No one work for glory (not even the rich), so I don't mind paying for good programs.

I agree with zzd10h
He maded a lots of works/utility/update those last years .... and all works need to be paid or have at least some form of "reconnaissance"

It is ironicall that it is french people (Me,Zzd10h,K-L) that defends Price/Works when usually France is seen (from outside) as a socialist country from Old Europe populated with cheese eaters ;-P

>Even a £1 program means I go without breakfast or lunch...
It is sad but food is not free too

Alain Thellier - Wazp3D

Anyone up for creating that shareware implementation I outlined above?

Perhaps I should create a new thread for it?

I support zzd10h in his endeavours!
Some of his programs have proven useful to me and I have happily made a small donation to him. My donation, would in no way have covered his time and effort.

I suspect that many people have found value in his work, but have not even said thank you, let alone donated anything.

Ask yourselves, if you bumped into him in the bar and got talking about all the great coding he has done would you offer him a beer?

Adding them to Amistore will simply allow him to get a few virtual beer tokens and thank yous to support his continued development.

@Minuous

Quote:

* There is absolutely NO indication that "lots" of freeware will turn into paid software. You're spreading FUD without any proof.

* Please stop calling hard-working developers "greedy", especially as the price they're asking for MONTHS of their work is absolutely ridiculous. This is an insult, a slap in their face.

* Please present some proof to your statement that "AmiStore is clearly damaging the Amiga community already". AmiStore hasn't been launched yet, so how do you know? Again, you're spreading FUD.

* If you don't want to buy from AmiStore then don't, and buy some bread and butter instead. But please do not tell US what WE should do to support our developers.

Right, this package will be a "PintWare"


Thank you !

@trixie +1

However, perhaps replying to poisonous commentators simply encourages them...?

>Rich people for a few euro una tantum ? :v

What? You should speak English, this is an English-speaking forum.

>Ah ah ah, asking just few euros for a pack of softwares that I developed since 2 years. That I have (and will) continuously maintained, supported replying to each improvements requests each particular bugs.

So? I have developed my free software for 20 years, and of course I respond to bug reports. I haven't asked anyone for anything despite being close to starvation much of the time, because I don't want to deprive anyone...

>Did you still used one of the programs listed in the first post of this thread ?

I'm not familiar with any of your programs, so of course it won't hurt me personally. However not being selfish I am concerned at the possible effects on other users, and a possible domino effect on other software.

>But I understand that for you it's more a principle problem.

Yes.

>No money, even ridiculous amount, should be asked for the very very lot of time spent in front of a computer...

If someone wants to donate to you, that is one thing. However what we have here is something completely different: removal of existing freeware from a freeware repository. It's not "asking" for anything by any stretch.

The normal course of action when commercializing freeware is to make *future versions* commercial, and normally such versions are considerably better than the older ones. (IIRC this happened with DOpus, DiskSalv, etc.) Not to attempt to suppress something that you have already released for free, you just can't change the licence conditions like that retroactively on an existing piece of software to try to criminalize users.

>Please stop calling hard-working developers "greedy"

The only reason for removal of the existing software is to gouge money out of Amigans who would have formerly been able to obtain said software freely.

>Please present some proof to your statement that "AmiStore is clearly damaging the Amiga community already". AmiStore hasn't been launched yet, so how do you know?

This announcement by zzd10h is itself the proof. AmiStore hasn't even been launched and yet we already have this kind of preemptive retroactive commercialization of freeware going on. As if Apple hasn't already damaged the Amiga enough in the past, we have parts of the Amiga community jumping on their crapp store bandwagon, damaging the Amiga freeware scene. Obviously AmiStore doesn't mean that everything has to go commercial. But it facilitates and encourages it, as we are now seeing. orgin had it right when he said "I guess we'll see more shareware in the future where the software has restrictions such as a 30 day timeout, limited number of starts, timeout popups and such...".

>If you don't want to buy from AmiStore then don't, and buy some bread and butter instead. But please do not tell US what WE should do to support our developers.

If you want to give him money, feel free. But please do not tell US that WE should pay for freeware.

Anyway, in the interest of not forcing users to pay for freeware, I am willing to host any of the listed suppressed software at my site for free download. And no, there's nothing illegal about that as it is all freeware, and it's not possible to retroactively change the licence conditions on existing software releases.

@Minuous

Quote:

It's latin, an ancient Italic language ..
"una tantum" more or less means: one time only

Quote:

James please don't be melodramatic, Guillaume never intended to criminalize anyone nor to force any of us to buy his software, current users are and still completely free to use his already released software without any extra condition.

Perhaps in this case would have been better to ask for some donations as an incentive instead, but Guillaume was curious to try this new platform and so it was, there is nothing in the dark, who know maybe later he will changes his mind ..

Please be constructive and don't getting hurt

>However what we have here is something completely different: removal of existing freeware[...]

Are you really sure about this ? I have only 2 original .lha packages from zzd10h here on my hard-drive (Sysmon,Fastview) the read-me say nothing about "freeware"

Alain

@Minuous

IIRC the developer can claim copyright and issue a DMCA takedown (Or whatever eqvivalent mechanism that may exist in the country where it would be hosted).

Anyway, regardless of what peoples individual opinion on what this does to the community at large or if it's a good idea or not, he's free to choose whatever he wants to do with his software.