Its over! Hyperion won!

@DAX

Check the details closely. The Commodore trademarks were sold, but Gateway only gave an exclusive license for the Amiga OS to Amino. They didn't sell ownership according to all the docs I've seen presented over the years.

Plaz

@Atheist

I've made my "guesses". I don't have anything more to say on the matter. It is good news for sure, but lets see what comes of it - if anything.

One thing might be nice, AmigaOS4 on all of the hardware projects (ACK, Troika, and that accelerator board project that was mooted).

@PulsatingQuasar Quote:
I did not (intend to) dismiss his remarks! I simply suggested that he may end-up waiting forever, if his expectations are too high.

I think most of what he asks for is already being worked on. But even the FireFox port is going to take some time, and OWB does a good enough job...

@ChrisH

Yes but where you went over the line was projecting additional motivations on behalf of the poster in question - implying they were looking for excuses not to buy AmigaOS4.

It is quite an investment to get on board. A decent Office Suite the poster sayes, well if only Cygnix was faster on the Sam you could point out abiword (as most people just mean "word processor").

But on the subject of OWB, it does a reasonable job, but the version I'm on has problems with form submission over a certain number of lines per textentry field. Thats enough for me to stop using it unless I force myself to remember it. In order to use what I need to use on AmigaOS4 with OWB I have to flip back and forth between that and NetSurf.

Either way it takes a desktop position, a kvm slot and for dedicated application users in order to justify the expense/position in their office it is going to need to step up somehow.

But yeah, many people will be forced to wait forever due to their circumstances.

@Plaz
Can you point those documents out? I am under the impression that Gateway (or their current owners) have no commanding options nor privileges over the OS parts, thus what they think is totally irrelevant I presume...

@DaveP

Hyperion is a co-operative now, if thats the same as a co-operative company in the UK then there are no share holders as such because there are no shares that can be traded in anyway. Again, assuming co-operative means the same as in the UK, then Hyperion is owned by members of the co-operative society who each have one vote (you can think of that as a single share in a plc that cannot be sold)

Jeff

@DaveP Quote:
That was not my intention.

@DAX

Here's a link to probably the most definitive description of the Gateway sale to Amino. Not sure who out side of Amino/Amiga Inc. has seen the actual agreement. I haven't. Based on this info, one would assume the OS is now safe. I have to imagine though that the patents are in some ways tied to the OS.

http://www.amigahistory.co.uk/jan3rd2000.html

My big question, who holds the copyrights? Since the time of the initial Amino buyout, I don't think I've every seen a doc or posting specifically saying "CorpX owns the copyright". I'm being picky perhaps, but it's an important detail.

Hopefully all will now agree Hyperion is the copyright holder to Amiga OS code and we can get on with business.

Plaz

@Plaz
I believe the patents refer to Amiga OCS and AGA, and licence to use them in future projects (including but not limited to emulation).
AmigaOS however was totally SOLD to them, which means Gateway does not own a cent of it.
Now Amiga OS is 100% in Hyperion's hands, as far as we are concerned it is a closed case.

@DAX

Some of the patents cover things within AmigaOS UI, such as menu multi-select. I don't know exactly what is there and I suspect most of the fundamental AmigaOS concept ones have expired by now anyway.

@Chris
Indeed, if there is some Intuition stuff dating back to os 1.3 it must be expired by now

@DAX

I wish to agree with you, but there seems to be much "clean up" that needs to be done. What ever Amino/Amiga Inc owned or not... they left a big mess. Have a look at this link. American copyrights are valid for many many decades. This list shows several bits that are registered to a host of intities... Commodore, Escom, Amiga Inc. Notice the link includes AOS3.1 registered to Amiga Inc. in 2007. Amiga Inc probably found it hard to defend their claims when the copyright records show so many different owners. If Hyperion truely owns it now, they need to get all this updated. I hope Hyperion can pull this all together that we may end this non-sense once and for all.


http://cocatalog.loc.gov/cgi-bin/Pweb ... commodore+&Search_Code=FT*&PID=EMuanA1aKTOf5YRsJJ2do7Op54&SEQ=20091019182341&CNT=25&HIST=1

Keep in mind there are two peices here. The hardware patents that expire after 21 years, and the copyright that basically last "for the life of the author plus 50 years, or 75 years for a work of corporate authorship. "

Plaz

@Plaz

AmigaOS is described as the sum of Exec, AmigaDos and Workbench.
These 3 are further described as the sum of other features which basically ARE what Hyperion uses.
Amiga OS was sold in FULL to Amiga Inc. and the patents they mention do not belong to either Exec, AmigaDos or Workbench (as all software technologies used in there belong to Amiga Inc.)

I believe the story ends there.

For chit chat sake i will add that the more we go farther the more new stuff will take the place of the older leaving no legacy parts whatsoever, sooner rather than later (OS5 will probably have a new kernel, Xul in place of reaction/gadtools etc. and who knows what more).

By the way, after switching to PowePC at the time of the first OS4, Hyperion differently reprogrammed (for a different CPU) the whole AmigaOS, new source code and methodology that might have already lost resemblance with the old one to the point where it is to be considered new and patentable parts in every possible way.

In the past a lot of court cases where different implementations, built from scratch for different hardware/CPUs and registered under new names, were judged in favor (and registered to) new legitimate owners, as they were considered totally New Products whose resemblance with the old ones was totally lost.

But alas the more they go ahead the more they move farther away from the past.

@Plaz

According to the Executive Update 3rd Jan 2000
http://www.amigahistory.co.uk/jan3rd2000.html

Here is what was acquired from Gateway:

1. All trademarks logo's etc.
2. All existing inventory of Amiga International
3. All existing licenses.
4. License to All Amiga patents (Gateway still owns the patents, but we are able to use them).
5. All web sites, and registered domain names.
6. The Amiga OS and all that is associated with the OS.
7. The Amiga operation as it exists today.

Acer now OWNS Gateway 2000, so Acer OWNS Amiga patents.

On October 16, 2007 the acquisition by Acer became final and Gateway became a privately held company and a wholly-owned subsidiary of Acer.
The board of directors resigned and a new board was appointed.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gateway,_Inc.

Maybe Acer dont know what they have ?

Has Hyperion a partnership with ACER ?

Is Hyperion interested in PA-RISC based Amigas ? SPARC64 VII ?

@angelheart
There were a TON of Amiga patents, some were part of AmigaOS, others were NOT. and Gateway owned the latter even during Amiga inc golden days.

Amiga inc bought AmigaOS from Gateway In FULL (they did NOT license it):
"
Here is what was acquired from Gateway:

1. All trademarks logo's etc.
2. All existing inventory of Amiga International
3. All existing licenses.
4. License to All Amiga patents (Gateway still owns the patents, but we are able to use them).
5. All web sites, and registered domain names.
6. The Amiga OS and all that is associated with the OS.
7. The Amiga operation as it exists today.
"

The patents that were only"licenced" and not purchased were all the remaining ones (in case they were needed).

Amiga OS was sold in FULL to Amiga Inc. and the patents they mention do not belong to either Exec, AmigaDos or Workbench (as all software technologies used in there belong to Amiga Inc. after their purchase)


And of course Amiga Inc. owns 3.1, Hyperion only has exclusive rights to use its technologies in order to build future OSs (which will belong in FULL to Hyperion).
Ownership of 3.1 is not put into question by this deal.

@DAX

R u sure ?

Thanks for the clarification

@angelheart
Pretty much, "The Amiga OS and all that is associated with the OS" leave no room for doubts.

As pointed out by Hyperion guys they even ruled out in the settlement any possibilities of farther hindrance (like selling 3.1 to competing parties too or coming out with other OSs with slightly modified names like "OS Five").

"Even if" I don't think any OS1 patent would hold true to 4.1 as there are a ton of differences that alone would justify total ownership by Hyperion, BUT let's say something comes up. How many days till Hyperion changes that small part of the OS and replaces it with a new implementation they fully own?

They could simply put out a "dot" release with the alleged part taken out, already replaced with something new they completely own.

This "pseudo" problem sounds like fud to me...

Aaargh! grr!

@Plaz
Why start imagining potential problems (that you can't ever be sure of to any great degree), when there are enough *real* issues that need dealing with?

@Plaz

Why? Unless anyone is in a position to challenge, or has motivation and rights to challenge there is no need to be overly concerned with "cleaning up" a mess that I'm not even sure is there or legally viable to capitalise on.