Itec attempts to grab OS4 while Hyperion attempts to add them to lawsuit

You can find all the court docs on Justia.

It seems Itec LLC tried to buy OS4 for $25k on June 20, 2007 from Hyperion. Hyperion then responded by trying to pull Itec into the ongoing lawsuit between Amiga Inc. and Hyperion.

This whole thing just gets weirder and dirtier. Best to make another bowl of popcorn.

@ssolie

What is the relationship between Itec and Amiga Inc?

This could work in Hyperions favour as Itec's claim will surely undermind Amiga Incs position.

@ssolie

Sounds to me like the men in grey are trying to bog down the case with legalese therefore "busting" Hyperions coffers.

I suspected they would try "outfunding" Hyperion.

Bill Buck was successful using this very tactic.

I wonder if the judge is reading any of the comments on the Amiga forums ?

@JeffShepherd

Itec OWNS Amiga, Inc.

Quote:
Hi ssolie,

I skimmed this at first, and thought you said "bowel".


I stand behind Hyperion winning the/any lawsuit, no matter what they pursue.

I _agree_ that Amiga Inc. went out on a limb and purchased Amiga IP for anywhere from 3 to 5 million dollars and DOES deserve compensation for that investment and profits, even, however, all their idiocy has led to stagnation of AOS4.x+ and NEAR DEATH too!!!

This has all gotten out of control, and I don't know who to point fingers at, as there are bigger things behind all of the failures..... (I won't go into that.)

All three companies involved (Hyperion Entertainment, Eyetech, and Amiga Inc. WA) have had awful trials and tribulations befall them.

I only attribute blame of fault to Amiga Inc. though.


They had money, and flittered it away into oblivion....
They ALMOST pursued two unacceptable paths (Linux and Linux), AOS _IS_ and OS....
Then they sat back and kept saying "someone else is working on it".

FINE!

Well, WHERE'S the "partnership" when all is said and done?

Amiga Inc (Del) tried to grab the "whole bowl of wax" with NOTHING left for the peple that PRODUCED something very, very special..... then _refused_ to maintain a partnership relation.

Well, boohoo for them, I hope nothing goes to them.... they had their chance.

They STILL pretty much refuse to tell us what the future in their eyes IS!

Except for what looks pretty much like "fake lies" of HW from ACK. I'm not calling ACK a liar, but that Amiga Inc. (is lying) REALLY intends to fund the building of NEW HW.


Amiga Inc (Del), LICENSE AOS4.x from Hyperion Entertainment for your dual G5 PA Semi MB!!!!!!!!

@Atheist

None of which effects the matter of OWNERSHIP. As uncomfortable as some might find that to be, it IS a rather important part of the puzzle.

@All

Well, after having read the absurd claims and counter claims being made by some people elsewhere on this subject, I shall await until we see some learned posts from our resident intellectuals, Mitch and GregS before I make up my mind what's going on

@Mikey_C

I don't think I can help much.

All that appears to have happened is that Hyperion has included Itec so that if it wins against the present AI, it won't have to deal with Itec separately - to that extent it makes sense.

The ownership issue, does not become any clearer, one way or the other. Itec as owners of both Amiga Incs (past and present) and KMOS, makes the whole thing appears to be merely a company restructure, with subsidiaries being faded in and out (not an uncommon thing).

Hyperion is hanging a lot on the "insolvency" issue, which I don't believe is all that strong, especially as the parent company seems to have arranged things to protect itself from insolvency. The incompleteness of the IP transfer surfaces again, the refusal of the $25,000 for the code offered this time(?) by Itec does not strengthen the case that Hyperion was being stripped of rights, though it might argue that the amount was not sufficient because of costs (though this has not been raised).

To my reading nothing devastating exists, rather it is a basic argument for bringing Itec into court, a restatement of the insolvency argument, and the argument that the IP was not properly transferred or proper notification given - ie what has already been stated re Amiga Inc replaced with Itec.

Don't get me wrong, Hyperion is sensible in bringing the parent company in, that had to be done, but now having brought it in, the bigger ownership questions come in (ie how Amiga Inc stands in relation to its parent company), that does not necessarily go in Hyperion's favour, but they had to do it.

@Billsey

Are you sure? I thought it was KMOS that bought Amiga Inc.

@JeffShepherd

I may be wrong, but the way I understand it Itec owned old AMiga Inc and KMOS which became the owner of assets later transferred into new Amiga Inc.

Itec seems to have stood as the parent company in all cases. I assume 100% privately owned companies of AI (old), KMOS and AI(new). Itec seems to be the parent of all, and KMOS seems to have been created as a holding company only.

If this is true, and I can only speculate, then the apparent confusion of who is who in zoo, is really just a fairly normal (not that I am justifying it morally) business restructure.

As private companies, and none apparently listed as Public, such things are common in order to shed debt and other liabilities while maintaining and protecting assets.

I would not be surprised that all assets are in fact "owned" by Itec, while subsidiaries act as agents for them.

In this way Itec had to be directly brought into the case, as Hyperion now has done. In some ways while this is unavoidable it will depend finally on how Itec has structured its ownership, rather than whether transfers had been made, that is if private ownership holds for all the companies involved.

I think that someone needs to make a DPaint drawing depicting the different entities involved so that we can "see" what it is that's happened.

1) Amino; Amiga Inc. (Wa)
2) Itec LLC
3) KMOS; Amiga Del.(aware) with head office now in Issaquah, WA??? (Soon to be Kent? So, are they still a Delaware company?)
4) Tachyon
5) Monrepos

This is insanity!



Now that Amiga (Del.) are embroiled in this court case, they can back out of the Kent (Wa.) Events Arena deal, saying "we need to spend our cash reserves elsewhere" (hmmm, never having had them in the first place???)

Let's see. They'll need $2.5 mil. as a downpayment, then $500,000 per year for 20 years ($10 mil. more). They also need right now, ~$2 mil. to pay to Hyperion Entertainment for AOS4.0. Total by September 2007 is $4.5 mil. + what they're giving to their lawyers. I think that if Hyperion Entertainment lose, they'll have to reimburse Amiga (Del.) their lawyers fees. (Subtract that from the 2 mil. they get.)

Q. If Hyperion Entertainment win, do you think Amiga (Del.) will have the money to reimburse Hyperion's lawyer's fees?? Can they squirm their way out of paying Hyperion's court costs? Even after it is shown that they were going to pay Kent Wa. $2.5 mil. to get to name the Events centre being built there??? (Obviously funneling money in from elsewhere (conveniently), when and where necessary.)




Well, they've done it again, looking at the contract and _selectively_ buying what they're interested in, not giving a flying fig of the other debt, that being, the "cost of production" of AOS4.0 itself. (I'm talking of the $25,000 they want to send from Itec to Hyperion Entertainment.)

ssolie: minor edit--don't even think about going there...

heh... Send in the zombies? Does this mean that Hyperion's
last shot at Ainc was such a body blow, that Ainc had to
resurrect the dead Itec?

Seems kinda desperate and sloppy on Ainc's part.

So if Itec wants to claim to be an operating continuation
of the 2003 Itec, shouldn't it be possible to find
continuous tax returns, corporate registrations, etc
for the last 4 years? Or might Itec also be demonstrated
to also be insolvent - again forgoing rights to Hyperion?

hmmm....

PJS

@pjs

Quote:

It was not Itec that was declared bankrupt back then. That was Kouri Capital. It was after that that Itec came into the picture. IIRC, Itec formed KMOS, who bought first the Classic Amiga OS, then Amiga. Since KMOS was formed by Itec, Itec owned KMOS, which then changed its name to Amiga, Inc. after having essentially purchased Amiga.

@Billsey

I wasn't referring to Kouri Capital or anything predating
our legal shell game. And I suggest that Itec and KMOS
presented themselves as separate entities (in spite of
secretly sharing the same principals/funding).

This shell game would appear to be supported by the
contemporary statements that KMOS was 'aquiring' the
AmigaOS rights from Itec (Fall'03).

Did they or didn't they make the sale?

Let's say they didn't (as they now seem to claim), then
wouldn't Itec now have to avoid the issue of insolvency
between then and now? My point would be: if Itec ceased
to exist between 2003 and now, wouldn't the rights (they
now claim) have fully reverted to Hyperion?

It would seem that if Itec's LLC was allowed to lapse
or they failed in their annual state/federal reporting,
either would be reasonable proof of their insolvency.

@pjs

Quote:

This is what you typed in your first post. It assumes that Itec ceased to exist. As far as I am aware, that is an indefensible assertion that appears to be designed to turn people against Amiga, Inc. If you can provide solid evidence to back up such an assertion, then I am sure the good folks here would appreciate it. Otherwise, you might want to stick to the facts: Itec formed KMOS, which then essentially purchased Amiga, after which KMOS changed its name to Amiga, Inc. The current Amiga, Inc. is not the former Amiga, Inc. They are two separate entities.

My own speculation regarding the intervening processes by which the current Amiga, Inc. came to be are these (which might not be true, but I am clearly marking them as what they are, speculations):

Kouri Capital was the silent partner to the former Amiga, Inc.

The ?Dot Bomb? occurred, bankrupting Kouri Capital pretty much in a day, the result being that the former Amiga, Inc. was left hanging out to dry through no fault of their own and no intention of Kouri Capital.

Once the owner(s) of Kouri Capital were able to regroup, they formed Itec, which then formed KMOS, which then essentially purchased the remains of the former Amiga, Inc. (sans debts) and then changed its own name to Amiga, Inc.

[EDITORIAL]
You know, there is a shining light in all of this: If Amiga is such a useless, tawdry, outdated thing, why is it that people with so much money (like those whom George Soros trusts with his own money) are so interested in owning Amiga that they would go through such a devastating thing as the Dot Bomb, pick themselves up, dust themselves off, grab up the remains of what was left from before the Dot Bomb, and start all over again with the same things, even recalling the same people whom the outside world (that is, us) love to blame for the collapse of the former Amiga, Inc.? If such recalled persons were really so incompetent that they are personally and uniquely responsible for the collapse of a corporation, then those whose lives revolve around stewarding and running and owning those very same corporations would not have recalled those people to the same job of running corporations. They would be seeking to put them in jail, not behind the top executive?s desk yet again. Bill McEwen did not knock on their door?they knocked on his. If he was so incompetent with THEIR MONEY previously, why did they knock on his door to put him back in control of THEIR MONEY? In light of what we know, and of what can be surmised from what we know, accusing Bill McEwen of incompetence or some form of underhandedness simply makes no sense.
[/EDITORIAL]

EDIT: Dropped words and phrases. D?oh!

@ssolie

$25k, what an insult

Rude!

@Billsey

Thanks for that glimmer. With all the knee-jerk bashing going on it is nice to see a well thought out response to this mayhem.

There are far to many surprises to this whole thing to realy know at this point what has happened.

Beyond making money we certainly do not know what the motives are behind the prime movers - how they intend to make that money.

I do not uderstand the hatred for Amiga, inc at this time. There are simply to many unanswered questions popping up to truly blame anyone for anything at this point. Both Amiga, inc and Hyperion are what is holding up Amiga OS. Lets hope they can reach an agreement without a full blown expensive trial.

@Billsey

> This is what you typed in your first post. It assumes that
> Itec ceased to exist. As far as I am aware, that is an indefensible
> assertion that appears to be designed to turn people against Amiga, Inc.

heh... I think AmigaInc's behavior stands for itself - no assistance
from me is necessary:

--- Rather than take the costlier/riskier route of moving the "Classic
Amiga" forward, they dropped the "Classic Amiga" like a hot potato
and tried to pawn someone else's unrelated technology off as the
new "Amiga".

--- When they failed to pay their employees and were losing in the
courtroom, they claimed insolvency.

--- When it looked like they might loose their assets, they shielded
them by selling the assets to what turned out to be themselves.

I was willing to give AmigaInc the benefit of a doubt for their
financial failings in the dot.com bust... I can appreciate the idea
of making a quantum leap with the Amiga "spirit"... I was even willing
to give McEwen some room for his claims of involvement in OS4... I
understand the perils of their gamble and the nature of marketing...

But now where does AmigaInc stand? They have created next to nothing
in seven years. What little they did do is dependent on a bankrupt
company. Their greatest feat appears to be their shell game of dodging
creditors and legal judgements.

And now as a third party has managed to take the technology THEY DUMPED
and move it beyond AmigaInc's wildest dreams, AmigaInc's response has
been to pull the questionable legal grab we are now watching.

As I said, I think AmigaInc's behavior stands for itself... furthermore,
it is reasonable to question whatever version of story/claims the
McEwen cabal might happen to be peddling today.

---Was McEwen the CEO or not?
---Was AmigaInc Isolvent or not?
---Itec & KMOS are one or not?
---Were the Amiga rights sold or not?

And so I'll restate: *I* would like to see proof the Itec of June 20th,
2007 has any connection to the 2003 Itec LLC that prevously said
they SOLD the Amiga rights to KMOS.

PJS

When a person refuses to see reason, choosing instead to blindly accuse, whom does it really say more about, their victim, or the accuser?